Excellent submission and respect to you for struggling to find the right wording. The submission by 'anonymous' is very recognizable, it's 100% my experience too. The lesbophobia in the gender identity pushers is off the scale. Stop transing the lesbians and gays away!
Absolutely. Breaks my heart that it's "rainbow" groups who are now the go to lived experience experts for govt that are pushing the most effective anti-gay movement of our times.
Yes well done indeed. Really punchy and fantastic to have this in the public realm. Just one question - can you give examples of the govt departments and their stacked with TRAs ally panels?
I find that alarming given the unscientific propagandist nature of many of those organisations. I had no idea they are taken into the fold and consulted as if their views are worth anything. The sooner these dubious groups are defunded, the better.
Yup. They have cornered the "experts" market. Supposedly rainbow groups who push their glossaries saying same-sex attraction doesn't exist, it's same-gender attraction, thereby honouring the homophobic tradition of stigmatising same-sex orientation. And women's groups like National Council of Women who say female is an identity and essential run a pro-trans campaign as their sole activity. Once feminist organisations like Family Planning, now Sexual Health NZ, who are all in on gender identity. At one point they removed the labels of female and male from their diagrams of genitalia. The very organisations we once expected to defend reality, and uphold the rights of women and gay people are now leading the anti-reality campaigns.
Yes those so-called women’s organisations are completely captured. As for the working groups etc, the penny is dropping. I must be slow. I’m only just realising how corrupt Wellington is to include these half-arsed groups peddling lies and misogyny as groups worth listening to in any debate. Seems there’s no limit to the depth of their stupidity.
Hell, you're not slow! I think we all, including myself, have a protective mechanism where we go oh, it's not THAT bad, because it seems inconceivable. NZ public service beholden to a theory that is incompatible with evolution, biology, or women's right to freedom of association. That can't be.
I don’t live in Wellington so that probably accounts for some of my ignorance. Those who live there know how the government and civil service work. It’s a revelation to me! I’m glad the government has promised to take a hard look at charities. They bloody need to.
Re the stacked panels, it's pretty common practice I think. You'll find representatives from Gender Minorities Aotearoa, Rainbow Youth, InsideOUT and Professional Association for Transgender Health Aotearoa (PATHA), all of whom subscribe to gender identity theory and affirm-only approaches on lots of different expert panels but some specific examples: (sorry comments don't seem to do live links)
Your introductory paragraphs are gold… but so is the text you finally settled on. It’s a true mystery why the public is being consulted because the MOH already holds all the evidence it needs to ban PBs - all it lacks is the moral courage to do the right thing.
Re MoH: totally. And thanks! There's always so much to say about each gender-related issue, isn't there? It's often hard to write anything without being tempted to write everything.
Go you !! and your tenacity to write a submission. I admit to my shame, that I surrendered in the face of those same difficulties and let life's busyness be my excuse. It's not only the difficulty of arguing with the "irrational" but the size of the 'forces' in the background... "The idea that humans have a moral and civil right to remodel their bodies because of some identity claim is a huge step towards abolishing altogether the notion of a human normal. Now, only ‘deplorables’ believe that human nature exists, and such discrediting of the idea of human nature is an essential precondition for Big Biotech advancing further than it has already."
Thanks Moomin Mama! Yes, where's your quote from? Incidentally, if Moomintroll put on a dress and the others were saying he was a girl and needed to take drugs then I have complete faith that Moominmamma would have looked into his eyes and said "You are my Moomintroll". Like the hobgoblin's hat scene in Finn Family Moomintroll (Tove Jansson for the non-initiated)...
__
'Isn't there anyone who believes me?' Moomintroll pleaded. 'Look carefully at me, mother. You must know your own Moomintroll.'
Moominmammma looked carefully, She looked into his eyes for a very long time, and then she said quietly: 'Yes, you are my Moomintroll.'
And at the same moment he began to change. His ears, eyes, and tail began to shrink, and his nose and tummy grew, until at last he was his old self again.
'It's all right no, my dear,' said Moominmamma. 'You see, I shall always know you whatever happens.'
Well noticed! and one of the many delightful interactions that made me identify myself here, with one of Tove Jansson's all too human characters. When a child I was Little My...
Excellent. Gender identity is non-sensical. Let’s hope the outcome of this consultation is not also non-sensical.
Excellent submission and respect to you for struggling to find the right wording. The submission by 'anonymous' is very recognizable, it's 100% my experience too. The lesbophobia in the gender identity pushers is off the scale. Stop transing the lesbians and gays away!
Absolutely. Breaks my heart that it's "rainbow" groups who are now the go to lived experience experts for govt that are pushing the most effective anti-gay movement of our times.
Exactly that! For crying out loud... :((
Thanks for your excellent submission.
I have started calling this Pretend Medicine!!
Have cross posted
https://dustymasterson.substack.com/p/rawhide
Dusty
Yes, pretend medicine! Because it's meant to improve or preserve health not disrupt it. Thanks for cross posting!
Exactly!!
Dusty
and you're welcome😄
Brilliant!
Your submission is excellent. Thanks!
Yes well done indeed. Really punchy and fantastic to have this in the public realm. Just one question - can you give examples of the govt departments and their stacked with TRAs ally panels?
I find that alarming given the unscientific propagandist nature of many of those organisations. I had no idea they are taken into the fold and consulted as if their views are worth anything. The sooner these dubious groups are defunded, the better.
Yup. They have cornered the "experts" market. Supposedly rainbow groups who push their glossaries saying same-sex attraction doesn't exist, it's same-gender attraction, thereby honouring the homophobic tradition of stigmatising same-sex orientation. And women's groups like National Council of Women who say female is an identity and essential run a pro-trans campaign as their sole activity. Once feminist organisations like Family Planning, now Sexual Health NZ, who are all in on gender identity. At one point they removed the labels of female and male from their diagrams of genitalia. The very organisations we once expected to defend reality, and uphold the rights of women and gay people are now leading the anti-reality campaigns.
Yes those so-called women’s organisations are completely captured. As for the working groups etc, the penny is dropping. I must be slow. I’m only just realising how corrupt Wellington is to include these half-arsed groups peddling lies and misogyny as groups worth listening to in any debate. Seems there’s no limit to the depth of their stupidity.
Hell, you're not slow! I think we all, including myself, have a protective mechanism where we go oh, it's not THAT bad, because it seems inconceivable. NZ public service beholden to a theory that is incompatible with evolution, biology, or women's right to freedom of association. That can't be.
I don’t live in Wellington so that probably accounts for some of my ignorance. Those who live there know how the government and civil service work. It’s a revelation to me! I’m glad the government has promised to take a hard look at charities. They bloody need to.
Thanks Yvonne.
Re the stacked panels, it's pretty common practice I think. You'll find representatives from Gender Minorities Aotearoa, Rainbow Youth, InsideOUT and Professional Association for Transgender Health Aotearoa (PATHA), all of whom subscribe to gender identity theory and affirm-only approaches on lots of different expert panels but some specific examples: (sorry comments don't seem to do live links)
-Stats NZ advisory group for their sex and gender identity data standard can be found under the terms of references on this page: https://www.stats.govt.nz/reports/reviewing-the-statistical-standards-for-sex-and-gender/
-Jan Rivers has talked about the community design team selected to set the policy direction for children in Oranga Tamaraki's care (page 2) https://www.publicgood.org.nz/wp/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Rainbow-Children-and-Young-People-in-Oranga-Tamariki-Care-21-2-2024-.pdf
Page 16 of this report shows the membership of the Working Group for reducing barriers to registered sex, https://genderminorities.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/Report-of-the-Working-Group-for-reducing-barriers-to-changing-registered-sex-full-report2.pdf
Not quite an expert panel but Sport NZ partnered with InsideOUT as an expert organisation for their inclusivity hub, https://sportnz.org.nz/diversity-equity-and-inclusion/transgender-and-rainbow-inclusion/. It shows.
The list goes on.
Your introductory paragraphs are gold… but so is the text you finally settled on. It’s a true mystery why the public is being consulted because the MOH already holds all the evidence it needs to ban PBs - all it lacks is the moral courage to do the right thing.
Re MoH: totally. And thanks! There's always so much to say about each gender-related issue, isn't there? It's often hard to write anything without being tempted to write everything.
Go you !! and your tenacity to write a submission. I admit to my shame, that I surrendered in the face of those same difficulties and let life's busyness be my excuse. It's not only the difficulty of arguing with the "irrational" but the size of the 'forces' in the background... "The idea that humans have a moral and civil right to remodel their bodies because of some identity claim is a huge step towards abolishing altogether the notion of a human normal. Now, only ‘deplorables’ believe that human nature exists, and such discrediting of the idea of human nature is an essential precondition for Big Biotech advancing further than it has already."
Thanks Moomin Mama! Yes, where's your quote from? Incidentally, if Moomintroll put on a dress and the others were saying he was a girl and needed to take drugs then I have complete faith that Moominmamma would have looked into his eyes and said "You are my Moomintroll". Like the hobgoblin's hat scene in Finn Family Moomintroll (Tove Jansson for the non-initiated)...
__
'Isn't there anyone who believes me?' Moomintroll pleaded. 'Look carefully at me, mother. You must know your own Moomintroll.'
Moominmammma looked carefully, She looked into his eyes for a very long time, and then she said quietly: 'Yes, you are my Moomintroll.'
And at the same moment he began to change. His ears, eyes, and tail began to shrink, and his nose and tummy grew, until at last he was his old self again.
'It's all right no, my dear,' said Moominmamma. 'You see, I shall always know you whatever happens.'
Well noticed! and one of the many delightful interactions that made me identify myself here, with one of Tove Jansson's all too human characters. When a child I was Little My...
The quote is from an interview with 'Reactionary Feminist' Mary Harrington https://europeanconservative.com/articles/interviews/the-reactionary-feminist-fight-against-cyborg-theocracy-mary-harrington-and-sebastian-morello-in-conversation/ I find her to be one of the most honest and challenging female writers of the current zeitgeist. She is the coiner of impressive phrases such as "cyborg theocracy" and "the Spreadsheet Egregore" I recommend her Substack https://www.maryharrington.co.uk/ among others "No one embodies more completely than these “detransitioners” the difficult experience of taking at face value the great lie of Meat Lego Gnosticism: that we could be freed from dependence on our bodies (and, implicitly, one another)." https://fairerdisputations.org/feminism-in-the-ruins-resisting-the-culture-of-chronic-disassociation/
Oh yes Mary Harrington! She makes such interesting and challenging points.